Dear Doc,
I have a question about “cock blocking” and the sketchy at best concept of the “bro code”.
Okay. So I’m on my way to chill at my friend’s house, and he tells me he has a girl over so I ask him if he wants alone time or whatever. He tells me it’s fine and that he’s not trying to hook up. So we’re hanging out and it turns out this girl is really extroverted and friendly, so we end up talking quite a bit. Just friendly talk, about music and TV and stuff.
(I should also note, that she engaged me in conversation, in no way was I trying to “swoop in” or whatever.)
Later, my friend decides he does want to hook up with this girl, and signals me to leave. So I go to his living room to watch some TV and chill on the couch. A few minutes later, the girl comes down as well, with my friend. We start talking again as I’m perusing netflix, meanwhile my friend is hanging out in the background sulking. He then asks her to come back upstairs with him, which she does and they hang out up there for a while. Later I find out she did not stay over and my friend says I totally “cock blocked” him because I talked to her “too much” and “would not stop talking to her”.
Now he tells me that I messed it up for him and that he won’t be able to hang out with her in the future (because reasons), and he goes on about how I talk too much in “those situations”. I decide now I’ve had enough of this, and I start getting really mad and indignant (I have anger issues) trying to explain to him how messed up his point of view really is, and he basically tells me that I was being a crappy friend and that I did not see his side of the issue.
Thing is, I think “his side” is complete bullshit and I refuse to acknowledge that he was “wronged” somehow. I should also mention that not once did he consider that maybe the girl just didn’t want to stay over, and it had nothing to do with me. I know that I’m right in this situation, that I did absolutely nothing wrong by engaging in conversation, but my friend is all up in my head and making me feel guilty like I wronged him somehow. So my question is, did I really mess up? Or is my friend just immature and self-centered?
Sincerely,
Annoyed And Confused
Ah, bro code, that mostly unwritten (and thus incredibly variable) list of things that bros supposedly do or don’t do to their bros. Drawing dicks on your drunk buddy’s face: totally cool. Talking to a woman he’s called “dibs” on: not cool.
But hey, what good is “bro code” if you’re not going to use it to hammer your bro in the nuts?
So let’s break down what happened here: your buddy invites you over. Knowing he has a woman with him, you give him the easy out: you’ll give him space to do his thing. He declines because “he’s not trying to hook up”. This very clearly sets the stage – not just for your involvement but for hers. Right now, she is at his house under the presumption that this is just a platonic, friendly hang-out.
(The cynic in me suspects that the only way he could get her to come over was to frame it as a platonic, friendly hang-out thing, but it’s entirely possible I’m being unfair.)
At this point, everyone is acting under the idea that yes, you’re all there just to hang out and bro down. Making small talk with people – especially people making a point of engaging with you – is kind of the whole point of hanging out together. If you were just going to completely ignore her or, I dunno, only answer in monosyllabic grunts, that would be incredibly fucking weird. As it is: no harm no foul, everyone’s being cool here.
It’s when your buddy decides that it’s go time and suddenly shifts the rules of the game that things get hinky. See, at this point, unless there was a pre-existing relationship with her, changing the terms under which she was at his house – from platonic brodeo to sexytimes – is going to feel like it’s coming out of the blue. Unless she was starting to give some very clear signals (and you don’t mention that she had been), this sort of “oh bee tee dubs, I want to suck face” face-heel-turn is going to feel like she was there under false pretenses.
Now under other circumstances, hanging around in the living room while your buddy is upstairs getting his freak on might feel a little weird to folks involved. She might have felt uncomfortable knowing you were just hanging around downstairs while she and your buddy were banging out. But under these circumstances… I’m guessing that she was less than thrilled to find out that your buddy had ulterior motives. Her coming back down, I suspect, was part of her trying to let him know that no she was not into it, thank you very much. After much sulking on his part – trés sexy, that – he convinces her to come back upstairs where presumably nothing happened. And now he’s blaming shit on you because… you were talking to her. Thus she didn’t like him as much and now it’s somehow your fault.
Uh-huh.
There’re two distinct problems with this scenario.
First: it completely erases the woman’s agency. She’s perfectly capable of deciding on her own whether or not she’s interested in having sex with someone without having to blame it on somebody else’s nefarious doings. Like I said: I’m guessing she was never that into him in the first place, and if she was, his playing “Schrödinger’s Date” with her did not endear her to him.
Second: if your buddy’s chances of getting laid are so predicated on her not talking to any other man at all, then guess what? They were already at zero and falling fast. I’ve seen plenty of Nice Guys play the “keep away” game, where they try to ward off every other possible man in the room. The idea is that by depriving her of any other options, she’ll naturally settle for the Nice Guy. Y’know. Instead of just hopping on the Nope Train to Fuck This Shitville.
There’s literally nothing about your buddy’s behavior that makes it sound like there was a snowball’s chance in hell that he was going to pull this off somehow. From his sullen sulking in the background to playing plausible deniability games, I am absolutely not surprised that she’s not going to see him again.
No, having a conversation with someone isn’t “cockblocking”. This isn’t your problem. This is your buddy acting like a spoiled dickbag.
Hey Doc!
I am in a happy long term relationship with a very stereotypical nerdy genius type. He is a great guy and with the exception of two things drive me insane, we have a fantastic relationship.
He’s a physicist who is currently earning a second degree in engineering. And in the ultimate cliche while being absolutely brilliant, he is also completely lacking in any common sense or short term memory what so ever, especially when it comes to the people and spaces around him. A few examples:
1. He recently smacked one of my girlfriends on her ass to get her to step out of the doorway he wanted to enter. When confronted on the utter inappropriateness of his action, his response was “Well if she had been facing the other way I just would have bopped her on the head. What’s the big deal?”
2. I had major surgery on my elbow recently. He came up behind me and gave me a very tight hug, squeezing the exact spot of the surgical incision. I screamed in pain and would have chalked it up to a one time error, only he did three more times after that, leading me to tell him that until I am fully recovered he is banned from hugging me from behind.
3. Similar to the second example, he has a habit of constantly coming up behind me to try and hug me or kiss my neck. He thinks it’s sweet and romantic, however he does it at the worst possible times, such as when I am making dinner. I have burned myself several times because he snuck up behind me while I was stirring a boiling pot.
And that leads me into the other issue I have. He is 35 years old and because he is over weight, has low self esteem, and is extremely socially awkward, I am the first relationship he has ever had that has lasted more then a few months. And because I have been his first in so many things, he is the clingiest, neediest person I have ever met. He cannot go more then 5 minutes without needing to hold me and fondle me which makes me extremely uncomfortable, especially in public settings. When he gets socially overwhelmed he tends to treat me like a security blanket, literally draping himself on top of me and trying to kiss my neck, shoulder, whatever body part is closest to him. If I try to get him to stop being on top of me, he will still follow behind me. Our friends have commented many times that he acts like a puppy following his human, and that dynamic disturbs me immensely.
I don’t dislike affection, but I am not a PDA person beyond holding hands or a quick hug or kiss. And even when we’re alone together, there reaches a point where I am ready to just chill out and stretch on the couch, but he still needs to be on top of me. If I make plans to go out with my friends he immediately asks to tag along and gets sulky when I tell him I need some girl time.
I’ve tried explaining to him that every time he ignores my requests to stop being on top of me he is not respecting my boundaries, His response was to say that since we are in a serious relationship we shouldn’t have any of boundaries.
I don’t know if the problem is him or me or both. I just know that these two things are driving me crazy and we’ve reached the point where we’re looking for an apartment. I’m not sure how I’m going to be able to handle him not letting me have any space at all and if he keeps not paying attention to anything, I’m afraid he’ll set the apartment on fire! Is there a way to get him to pay more attention to the things that bother me or is there a way to teach myself to get less annoyed by it? I’ll take either one at this point. I love and adore him, I just don’t know how to deal with these two aspects of his personality on a constant basis.
Thanks for you help,
Not A Security Blanket
So normally like to go through letters like these in the same way they’ve been laid out, addressing each issue as it comes up. But frankly, NASB, you dropped one GIANT red flag in the middle of this and I’m not getting past it.
“I’ve tried explaining to him that every time he ignores my requests to stop being on top of me he is not respecting my boundaries, His response was to say that since we are in a serious relationship we shouldn’t have any of boundaries.”
Holy hopping sheep shit, NASB, how did this line not tell you that this is a bad scene? I’m sorry, but being in a relationship does not negate the existence of boundaries and the fact that he so flagrantly disregards them – insisting that they shouldn’t even exist – is a GREAT BIG FLASHING sign that this relationship is in trouble.
You say he’s a great guy. OK, if you say so. But his behavior here is telling me that he’s got a giant host of problems. He smacked the ass of someone he presumably doesn’t have ass-smacking privileges with and doesn’t see the problem with it. He ignores your very clearly stated boundaries. He’s forever clinging to you – literally – in social situations, even when he knows they make you uncomfortable. He doesn’t give you space, ever, and he gets sulky and resentful that you need time to yourself or with your friends. Knowing all this – even knowing in advance that being in a tight space with him is going to drive you nuts – you’re planning on getting an apartment together?
I’m sorry to put it this bluntly but that’s an incredibly stupid idea. You’re getting annoyed by him because the way he’s acting isn’t just immature and clingy but downright unacceptable in a lot of cases. I sympathize that the guy’s got low self-esteem and a bad case of being socially awkward but frankly, being socially awkward doesn’t excuse you from having to act like a grown-ass adult. This isn’t something you need to learn how to get over; your boyfriend needs to grow the hell up and get over this behavior. But to be perfectly honest, I don’t think he’s going to. Honestly, I think it’s going to get worse and the longer this relationship goes on, the more you’re going to be his mommy as well as his girlfriend.
Look, you tell me you’re happy and have a fantastic relationship, and honestly I have to take you at your word. But this isn’t a case of someone with a few inconvenient but otherwise lovable flaws. This isn’t one or two problems, this is someone who’s acting like a 13 year old who continues to ignore your comfort or even basic wishes to not be smothered, figuratively and literally. If you want him to improve, then you’re going to have to lay down the law and let him know that his behavior’s unacceptable and needs to change. And I don’t mean a month or two on his best behavior until he figures you’ll let him slide again, I mean legitimate, lasting change. And frankly, if he doesn’t… well, I know it’s not what you want to hear, but I strongly suggest you rethink your relationship with him.
And whether you do end things or not, do not get an apartment together.
Sorry to be so blunt NASB, but that’s how I see it.
Good luck.