ask dr. nerdlove Archives - Paging Dr. NerdLove

Ask Dr. NerdLove: Am I Dating an Incel?

October 11, 2019 by Dr. NerdLove Leave a Comment

Hey Doc,

To make a long story short, after a decade-long relationship that lasted from my early twenties to early thirties, I’m now dating again. I’m a straight woman in a major urban area. I’ve been relying primarily on dating apps, which has had some ups and downs. I recently met a really nice guy and we’ve gone on a couple dates. He’s been very respectful, attentive, and has never pressured me in any way. He’s actually a breath of fresh air in comparison to some of the other guys I’ve met from the apps.

Except (there’s always an except, right?) that on occasion he has espoused incel-type beliefs and terminology, including the 80-20 thing (that the top eighty percent women are drawn to the top twenty percent of guys), made a joke about how that’s why women always pick the assholes, and talked about Chads when I was sharing some of my funny dating app-related disasters. (It came up organically in the conversation.) I’m frankly confused. He’s an intelligent, good-looking guy, a good conversationalist, and overall a fun date. He doesn’t come across as being misogynistic at all, but I’m worried that if I continue going down this route and become invested, I may discover too late that’s he holds really toxic beliefs about women. I’m not sure if he’s sort of part of the less extreme wing of that community, a full-blown incel, or just a nice guy who’s been kicked around a little and taken comfort in some of the incels’ self-comforting fantasies without realizing how toxic they come across as being to other people. Whenever the subject comes up, he’s very straightforward about it as though relaying a normal fact about life, and doesn’t act ashamed or embarrassed at all. He’s older than me and hasn’t mentioned much about his dating history.

At this point in my life, I know better than to do battle with someone’s beliefs, and it’s not like he’s a long-standing friend or family member so I would be justified in making that type of intervention. The easiest thing to do would be to walk away, but I like him. I also know that I’m gun-shy due to some of my own past baggage, mostly related to how my long-term ex treated me, so I’m not sure if I’m looking for an excuse not to commit and avoid being hurt again. Since you’re a guy, I thought you might have a better take on this than me. What do you think?

Does That Make Me Stacy?

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Ask Dr. NerdLove: Is It OK To Be Friends With My Wife’s Ex?

October 7, 2019 by Dr. NerdLove Leave a Comment

Dear Dr. NerdLove:

I’m writing to you in hopes of receiving your impartial insight into a particularly tricky personal situation. My wife (Alpha) and I just celebrated our 5th anniversary, although prior to getting married we’d already been in a long-term committed relationship that had culminated in living together. There’s one troublesome long-standing issue that’s been present in our relationship since the beginning, though: her ex. Let’s call him Beta.

The three of us have known each other since we were teenagers. At that time, we were all part of an online mailing list, and a few particular folks had formed a smaller, more tightly-knit offshoot. Beta was the one who invited me to join their group of about 8 others, one of whom was Alpha. At the point that I became friends with them, the two of them were already in a long-distance relationship and had already met up in person a few times. I got along better with Beta than Alpha at that that time, likely since he and I shared more interests during those years.

Fast forward several more years to the point where we are all ostensibly young adults. After graduating college, Beta happened to get a job in my neck of the woods. I still chatted with Alpha occasionally and I knew she and Beta were still seeing each other. What I didn’t know was that their relationship was already falling apart at this point. He had been cheating on her with some other online relationship that she found out about and confronted him about. They argued, had a break from each other, and then she tentatively forgave him and tried to get back together with him. That had only been one transgression out of a list of others she’d tried to overlook in an attempt to keep their relationship together though, and eventually the two of them broke up again. There was a period after that where I lost touch with Alpha as she was trying to juggle both picking up the pieces and studying abroad. When I graduated college myself, Beta offered to let me move in with him for a while.

Some years later, Alpha and I began talking more frequently. Eventually, she said she was interested in me. I was interested in her too, but felt torn at the time since I was still rooming with Beta. Before proceeding into a potential relationship, I wanted to talk to him and make sure that he was OK with me seeing his ex-girlfriend and that it wouldn’t be too awkward. He told me he wasn’t bothered by it, so I told her I wanted to give it a shot. We didn’t always click at first, but we eventually said ‘I love you’ to each other and began a serious relationship. I still didn’t know the details about her time with Beta and his cheating on her. She was vocal about her negative feelings toward him, but I stubbornly thought it was something that would ‘work out’ where she would eventually be friends with him again. When she came to visit, it seemed like they were trying to be cordial with each other, at least.

Now that we’ve been together for quite some time and had some long discussions about it, I understand that he cheated on her, and that rather than admitting to her that his feelings for her had diminished, he’d just let their relationship wither away because he wanted to avoid confrontation. I was greatly disappointed in him when I learned how he’d treated her. Beta doesn’t live around here any more, but my other local friends and I have continued to maintain an online friendship with him. That doesn’t make things easier for my wife, but she’s also said that she couldn’t bear to see me cast aside essentially my oldest friend. I keep wondering if things might be easier for her if I did. She’s seen a therapist who has validated the feelings she has about Beta and their relationship, but she’s not ‘free’ from those feelings and can’t fall back on the comfort of ‘well at least I never have to see or hear from him again’. She dreams of him frequently and wakes up feeling exhausted, angry, and depressed simply from having to think about him. I worry that even if he were truly out of her life completely, would any of that really just ‘stop’? I’m not expecting her to either forget or forgive him, but I want to help her not have to feel the pain of that past relationship constantly. Is there something more I should be doing for my wife? Am I being selfish in maintaining my friendship with Beta? I feel like he’s striving to be a better, more honest person. I think, “I’m sure I’ve hurt people when I was younger, too,” but I don’t know if I’m only looking at it through my ‘this guy was my best friend’ lens and I’m actually completely out of line.

Thanks very much for both your time and for any feedback you have to offer, Doc.
Sincerely,

Exes & Oh No’s

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Ask Dr. NerdLove: How Do I Ask My Bartender for A Date?

September 30, 2019 by Dr. NerdLove Leave a Comment

Dear Dr. NerdLove:

I wanted to reach out to you because I’m seeking guidance on a potential relationship, but am uncertain of how to proceed.

About 2-3 years ago, I went with a friend to a nearby bar, which featured a “Taco Tuesday” special after we had both seen “Sorry to Bother You,” and wanted to discuss it further. Needless to say, the bartender working that night was sociable (especially once I showed an interest in her work and craft) and overall it was a good time.

A year or so later, I came back to the bar one night to meet some other friends. Once again, she was working there and seemed happy to see me. We caught up a bit, and much to my surprise, comped me for one of my drinks, which was sweet and generous of her. This back-and-forth carried on throughout the rest of last year. I’d show up, eat, drink, tip generously, and talk. It turned out we had a good amount in common: she’s a photographer, I crew on film/video jobs. We both love talking mixology and different liquors and liqueurs.

In short, I developed a bit of a crush on this bartender. And after introducing her to some of my friends, they also picked up on a potential mutual interest vibe. So near the end of last year, I expressed an interest in hanging out with her outside of her workplace. She, much to my surprise, gave me her cell phone number and seemed willing to meet. She did express a desire to keep it casual, however, although that was not a deal-breaker for me. As someone who has to be friendly and sociable to keep working, making friends is always easier and slightly more comfortable to me.

So I reached out to her at the beginning of this year to see if she wanted to get coffee. She did text back that she was in favor of it, but we never got a date or time pinned down, so I let it go, not wanting to pressure her. Fast-forward to now, where I stopped into her bar for a meal and some drinks. She was working there and seemed very happy to see me, so much so that she came around the bar to sit next to me as we both talked about our lives. At this point, even I felt like there was some kind of chemistry between us, and this was before the liquor started flowing.

Later on, I sent her an invite by way of a text message to a casual event among friends, but she didn’t respond, though I didn’t take it personally. Given her desire to keep things simple, I figured pushing her for an answer wouldn’t be helpful.

So in summary, I’ve been interested in getting to know this bartender a bit more outside of the place she works. We have common interests and goals, and seem to get along well enough when at her workplace. The question is where the boundaries for this relationship are.

If it can be romantic, that would be fantastic. If it’s more of a friendship, I would also enjoy it greatly, since I find myself cherishing those the most. If it’s more of a casual acquaintance-type of deal, I also would be willing to accept it, since the matter would be settled. The issue comes down to asking whether there’s room for this relationship to grow at all outside of the bar.

I’ve read enough articles and essays to know how often women have to be diplomatic when refusing the advances of men, and the difficulties of navigating that space safely. Therefore, I’ve tried to avoid overstepping my bounds with her or violating what trust I’ve earned.

Any advice or help you could provide here would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

-Searching for Boundaries

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Ask Dr. NerdLove: How Do I Keep The “Friend” In The FWB?

September 27, 2019 by Dr. NerdLove Leave a Comment

Dear Dr. NerdLove:

I am a 33 year old single, heterosexual female living in a large metropolitan area nearish the east coast. There’s a man who’s been in my life on and off for the past ~6 years, but in the last 3 years we’ve spent more time together, including in a romantic, sexual capacity, yet still casual. We’re very close in age, but less so in distance: we live in different states, separated by a two hour plane ride. Through traveling we intend to see each other F2F at least once a quarter and very recently met up F2Fd when he came to visit and stay with me for a short weekend.

We are settling into a budding friends with benefits relationship, a relationship archetype I only truly became comfortable with in the last 6 months as I matured emotionally and became more self-aware. I definitely had some help through your article on FWB (how the phrase still includes the word “friend” and no strings attached doesn’t equate to no respect or no consideration). It was your article which allowed me to view this relationship through a different, healthier lens—it’s fair to say I am far more open, flexible, and vulnerable in this FWB now than I was 2 years ago which has really helped this relationship flourish considerably, even in a short period of time

There is no expectation of commitment or monogamy on either side now or in the near or distant future. We’re enjoying one another as people, friends, and lovers and just seeing where things take us. My question is what happens to our relationship when one or both of us meet someone else, someone else who has expectations of commitment and monogamy which the respective person involved is willing to fulfill? Once you’ve crossed over from being friends to something more, is there anyone going back? Can the sexual/romantic/non-platonic aspects of our relationship be turned on and off like a faucet? Or excised as a foreign, inanimate, or unnecessary vessel or object? And beyond the “can” what about the “should”? If you can turn off certain aspects of a relationship, should you? Can you cherry pick and preserve the friendship in the relationship whilst leaving the romance or sex in the past? In addition, is it reasonable for anyone involved (me, my FWB, a future partner for either of us) to expect our FWB relationship to end in its entirety? Is it equally reasonable for this man and I to expect the friendship aspect of our relationship to persevere through commitment and monogamy elsewhere?

This is a relationship I value and wish to cultivate, how do I do this while still respecting and cultivating other relationships which have the potential to become committed and monogamous?

Do Not Pass Go

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Ask Dr. NerdLove: How Do We Stop Fighting Over Our Wedding?

September 23, 2019 by Dr. NerdLove Leave a Comment

Hey Doc,

Long time reader, first time writing in. My fiancé (22) and I (23) have been together for a lovely 5 years, have never had a single fight and have been fairly good at communicating. Our wedding is scheduled for mid next year and we have of course got into the intensive planning phase.

She knows I’m tight with my money and don’t like to spend carelessly, but she’s always had a dream of a fancy (and expensive) wedding. I always thought that people that spent $20k-$25k or more on a wedding were insane and wasteful, especially in a world where people have so little. However, I was ok with picking a venue that costed $15k (which included the space, food, open bar, etc.) even if it was beyond my original budget (my attempt of compromising).

However, we got a price estimate for changing the chairs to a nicer style and the total cost for switching the chairs would have added over $1000 to the wedding price. My red alert goes off as this is a complete scam, why would we pay for this? I make my feelings known and she agrees to not do the chairs…until later that night she is crying (literally) about how the wedding isn’t going to be everything she dreamed of already and she misses her dad (who passed away when she was young) makes me feel terrible so I let her decide on whether she really wants the chairs.

This is really nagging at the principled part of me though that looks at how much time and energy I would have to spend to make $1000 just for chairs, and how so many people around the world barely have anything. She’s paying for a majority of the wedding (with money from her father’s passing) so I keep trying to tell myself, “It’s her money she can spend it however she wants.” The other part of me can’t believe that she’s just like, “well we have the money so we can spend it.”

Am I thinking to much about this? Is this standard marriage stress getting to me? Or is the principled part of me right to think that $1000 for chairs that no one will care about besides her is ridiculously wasteful?

Thanks for your advice,

Stereotypical Wedding Issues

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