Women Like Assholes (And Other Dating Myths)

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It’s been about six months or so since I addressed that perennial bugbear of nerd dating, the Nice Guy, and after some of the comments I’ve seen, on the blog and elsewhere, it seems like as good a time as any to revisit the topic.

Y’see, there are certain myths and misconceptions when it comes to dating that seem to have become axiomatic amongst men and chief among them is the classic “Women like assholes”. It’s the cry amongst the hapless Nice Guys that women only like assholes and therefore ignore the Nice Guys who would, like, totally treat them with respect man…

Meanwhile, other men will tell you over and over again that you need to be the Alpha Male, that you need to be dominant and prove you’re her social superior. Preferably by insulting her and pretending you don’t give a shit about her.

“Nothing to be done about it,” we hear. “Society tells men they’re supposed to be powerful, this is how powerful people act. Women like power and status.”

Meanwhile, Nice Guys continue to put the blame on everybody but themselves and the cycle continues.

So let’s talk about that for a little, shall we?

Where Does This Myth Come From, Anyway?

If you were to listen in on men’s conversations when the subject of dating issues, you would think that assholes – and their close cousin, the Alpha Male – has some sort of mystical, mesmeric power over women; the hint of douchebaggery and Ed Hardy clothing acting as the alchemical formula to getting more ass than a man in a car chase that plows through an ass cart and crashes through a plate ass window.

"Aim for the Ikea! I'm in the mood for blondes tonight!"

And yet, if you were to ask women – and believe me, I did – it’s all bullshit. Now maybe women don’t necessarily want passive Nice Guys with their senses of entitlement and passive-aggressiveness, but that doesn’t mean that they want some dickbag who patronizes her, insults her and generally treats her like crap, right?

And yet, we see hot chicks with douchebags. So many, in fact, that they have a Tumblr dedicated to it1 So clearly there’s something to it, right?

I mean, that's the only possible explanation for this, right? Right??

So… what gives?

Well, it’s about exposure, mostly. You see assholes with hot women. They’re staring at you from the covers of the gossip magazines and the front pages of TMZ with the latest arm candy. They dedicate shows to horrible people who do nothing but party, act like coked out hamsters, pick fights and fuck. We see people in power acting like assholes, asshole celebrities who seem to be famous strictly for being famous (or for fucking famous people).

And of course, the guy who’s busily banging away at the girl you like – you know, the one who seems to be the source of all of that drama she keeps coming to you with, the one who couldn’t possibly treat her the way you would – he’s definitely an asshole.

Tally it all up and you could be forgiven for thinking that being an asshole is the common denominator.

What About Being An Alpha Male? Chicks Dig Alphas, Right?

In the primate world, the alpha male is the dominant ape in the herd who stands at the top of the informal hierarchy by dint of his strength, health and overal fitness. These are all favorable factions that influence his potential survivability, which in turn mean that his children are more likely to survive to pass on their genes. Because of the way ape sociology works2, the alpha male has the most access to food and the females. The apes below him in the hierarchy, the Betas, have a greatly reduced access to sex, food and basic dignity. The Alpha keeps his position via intimidation and furious violence. Betas who piss off the Alpha do so at their own risk.

I’m sure you can imagine how people might see this reflected in humans.

Seem familiar?

 

In fact, there are plenty of people who try to map the idea of Alpha and Beta behavior into the dating realm. Nice Guys aren’t having sex, therefore they’re the Betas. Assholes are having all the sex; ergo, they’re the Alphas. So, if Nice Guys are Betas and assholes are Alphas, then it makes sense to try to emulate that behavior, right?

 

The problem of course, is that the idea of the Alpha Male having access to all the females and the Betas having none goes right out the window when you’re dealing with humans. But hey, it sounds like a simple, easily digestible solution to solving the world’s dating problems, right? When you take a bunch of people with a shaky grasp on evolutionary psychology who try to apply the concept of Alpha onto the convoluted morass that is human sexuality and sell it as advice, you end up with the vague idea that being “alpha” means being “dominant” or “socially superior”.

 

Just how this so-called dominance is supposed to manifest is, in itself, a subject of great contention amongst the sages of the dating world. Some will tell you that it’s all about being unreactive and proving you don’t need or care about her as much as she needs or cares about you. Some will tell you that it’s about staring down or squeezing out the other men around the woman you’re interested in. Some will say that it’s about keeping her insecure in the relationship and always having to please you.

In other words… you’re supposed to act like an asshole.

So Why Do We Think It’s True?

The reason why it’s become accepted that women like assholes is due to a logical fallacy known as the defective induction.You see women with assholes repeatedly and you assume that this is universally true… no matter how many women you see or know personally who’re dating perfectly decent individuals.

Now spread that out amongst frustrated men who’re angry about the fact that the women they like are dating jerks. As they carp and moan and commiserate about how unfair life is, they’ll all agree that it seems as though women prefer to date assholes instead of nice guys like them, which provides seeming confirmation. After all, if their friends are noticing this too, surely this means that there’s something to it, right?

Well, there’s a reason why the plural of “anecdote” isn’t “data”. And don’t call me Shirley.

Humans are complex beasties, sexually. There’s a hell of a lot going on under the hood that we’re not even vaguely aware of or even able to control on a conscious level, and these are all things that lead up to answer the question of “Will I fuck this person or not?”

For example: women have a natural attraction to high levels of testosterone in men. Outward indicators of high levels of testosterone: wide jawline, body hair, even behavior such as competitiveness and risk-taking will trigger a response in women. If a woman is ovulating, her reaction to high testosterone is even more pronounced. However, this reaction isn’t binary or constant; a women who are at the waning phase of their menstrual cycle tend to prefer less masculine men; that is, men with lower levels of testosterone.

Men who are less “alpha”, as it were.

And all of this is before we get into the psychological aspects that help define who and what we’re attracted to.

But “Hey, we’re all really fucking complex machines” doesn’t sell a lot of books. And then frustrated nerds and Nice Guys give up and start trying to act like dicks without understanding just what it is that women do find out about assholes. As far as they know, as long as they emulate the traits of an asshole, they should be getting tail too. And so, like a Pacific Islander cargo cult that thinks that building an ersatz air strip will lead to goodies raining from the skies, frustrated nerds, pick up artists and Nice Guys start acting like cocks in hopes of getting laid more often.

"Yes, give into your hate. Let your anger flow through you bro."

And surprise surprise, when they’ve quit being passive and anxious and actually start standing up for what they want and making demands instead of pleading… they have a little success. And that little success is far more than anything they had before, which further confirms that “women love assholes”.

  1. Not terribly surprising. There’s Tumblrs for just about everything now. It’s like Rule 34 mutated, escaped into the wild and started breeding with imageboards. []
  2. With the exception of the Bonobos, who are the sexual equivalent of the really smart kids who wreck the curve. []

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Comments

  1. Matching todays XKCD: http://xkcd.com/1027/

    • Dr. NerdLove says:

      There's a reason I love XKCD.

      • Paul Rivers says:

        lol, I like this article, am I the only one who read the xkcd article and thought "The lesson is that you can't *pretend* to be an asshole – you have to genuinely *be* one for it to work?"

        Note that I'm not commenting that not being does or doesn't also work, only saying that was kind of the funny conclusion I got from the comic.

        • I read today's XKCD, too! I was wondering if anyone else would notice that. It was pretty funny. XD

    • kimberly cook says:

      I do not like assholes….. men are men. EWither you will accept them, or not….

  2. women aren't attracted to assholes.

    assholes are attracted to other assholes.

    • Agreed. The majority of these women are probably assholes too. Just because a girl is "hot" does not mean she's a good person or a good mate. I am a smart and talented woman. i have friends who are also smart and talented and funny. We don't go after assholes. But since we're not "FLAMING HOT", nobody cares.

      (I'm not saying all "hot" women are assholes, because I know a lot of beautiful women and they're lovely people. The acquaintances I do have who are "hot" and date "assholes" are not the nicest or considerate people.)

      • exactly. and I know this for a fact because the asshole girls dated the asshole guys in highschool. and you know what? their parents were assholes too.

        assholes mate with assholes and ten breed more assholes. oh boy.

        seriously people need to stop whining about how that guy/girl they have a crush on dates all the assholes. all in all it was probably a favor in disguise and i don't know why people are stupid enough to not get this.

        it doesn't matter anyways because the only goal most of these people usually have is to get laid anyways and use a relationship as an excuse.

    • Paul Rivers says:

      "women aren’t attracted to assholes.

      assholes are attracted to other assholes."

      That is *so* true.

      The other thing about that is that assholes often can't stay in relationships. Let's say 20% of the population are assholes – but how much of the *single* population are assholes? It's like monster.com is *filled* with people who can't get jobs for one reason or another. The people who are both attractive and nice people are far more likely to be unavailable (because they're in a relationship). A really large number of the attractive girls who I've met who I also would have wanted to date based on their personality are dating the guy they met in their freshman year of college – forever. Sometimes they're married, sometimes they're engaged, sometimes they're just boyfriend/girlfriend since then.

      It's kind of like the saying "All thumbs are fingers, but not all fingers are thumbs."

  3. also kinda off topic those 'hot girls' in the blog link posted are ugly as sin.

  4. Reasons why some women really do go for assholes (not confident guys):

    1) they're assholes too (as above)

    2) They have incredibly low self esteem

    3) they've fooled themselves into thinking he's needy/ damaged and they can 'save' him. you can apply all the same lessons of the White Knight post to women who try to save men who treat them like crap.

    4) They are mean, but hot/ fun. Women can be shallow too.

    But, mostly, they're not assholes- they're just independent/ confident rather than needy/ clingy. Oh, also, in the case of the guy who's dating the woman crying on your shoulder- if you assess anyone by how their SO describes them in the middle of a fight they'll look bad. That doesn't make them an asshole all the time. (And it doesn't help that you'll be predisposed to hate him anyway.)

    • Or assholes are the only ones acting interest in dating/ hooking up and all the other people are trying to be surrogate siblings.

    • I'm on board with what you just said especially at the end for the fact that you can forgive said person for what they did or what they said but the nice guy/girl/person/friend whom is hearing or seeing the negative outcome from the fight is not going to. My opinion is to not say anything about the relationship unless you plan on telling everything good and not just one end of the story because of high emotions.

  5. cthulhuhungers says:

    Another reason why 'women like assholes' is false- because there are 3 billion of us and maybe, just maybe, some of us might have different preferences when it comes to mates. On account of, you know, being individual *people*. Really, any time you say 'All woman are X" you're gonna be wrong, just as I'm sure the commenters on this site would (rightly) leap up to prove me wrong if I was to say "all nerds are creepers" or "all men are assholes"

    • Athirson says:

      Concur that all-or-nothing thinking gets you nowhere.

      Maybe a better way to frame it would be, …All other factors being equal, women are more atracted to assholes than nice guys…

  6. An example of how complicated sexuality is:

    I know a guy who is a really physically attractive Nice Guy (also actually a nice guy.) Because he's SO unwilling to be imposing, he's totally undemanding, and totally emotionally shut off, to the point of seeming kind of dead behind the eyes.

    This is a total turn off for most girls looking for a relationship. But girls looking for casual sex eat him up! Hot, eager to please, expects and demands nothing. What more could you want?

    So girls like assholes, but only if they're not actually mean to them, except for asshole girls who may or may not be a little damaged, except when they want a Nice Guy boy toy? Complicated stuff.

  7. Paul Rivers says:

    "In the primate world, the alpha male is the dominant ape in the herd who stands at the top of the informal hierarchy by dint of his strength, health and overal fitness. These are all favorable factions that influence his potential survivability, which in turn mean that his children are more likely to survive to pass on their genes. Because of the way ape sociology works2, the alpha male has the most access to food and the females. The apes below him in the hierarchy, the Betas, have a greatly reduced access to sex, food and basic dignity. The Alpha keeps his position via intimidation and furious violence. Betas who piss off the Alpha do so at their own risk."

    I don't know if posting this has a point, but it reminded me of this recent article –
    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/15/science/15baboo

    Laurence R. Gesquiere, a research associate in the department of ecology and evolutionary biology at Princeton, and colleagues report in the journal Science that in five troops of wild baboons in Kenya studied over nine years, alpha males showed very high stress levels, as high as those of the lowest-ranking males.

    The stress, they suggested, was probably because of the demands of fighting off challengers and guarding access to fertile females. Beta males, who fought less and had considerably less mate guarding to do, had much lower stress levels. They had fewer mating opportunities than the alphas, but they did get some mating in, more than any lower-ranking males. After all, when the alpha gets in another baboon bar fight, who’s going to take the girl home?

  8. Paul Rivers says:

    "For example: women have a natural attraction to high levels of testosterone in men. Outward indicators of high levels of testosterone: wide jawline, body hair, even behavior such as competitiveness and risk-taking will trigger a response in women."

    Reading that comment, I thought this article was interesting –
    http://www.debbieschlussel.com/19888/girlie-man-n

    (Note – crap, it looks like you used to be able to read the full article online but now you have to subscribe to do it).

  9. Paul Rivers says:

    "Nice guys tend to be too concerned about other people. They’re worried about what other people might think. They’re worried about whether the girl they like might like them back. If the nice guy has especially low self-esteem, he’ll worry whether his approaching a woman is an inconvenience to her."

    *Some* of the nice guys – not all of them, but the kind I've been in the past – ended up this way because they were *told* that being super passive is what girls *wanted*, that being assertive was something girls hated, and they were told this by figures they either respected greatly (like the church) or by important female figures in their lives. And – they believed them.

    They believed that hearing "Oh god, some guy was hitting on me – again!" a bazillion times meant that all girls always hated a guy who ever hit on them in any way.

    When they were a kid their parents and society always told them that girls "wanted guys who were there for them", and they now believe that that is a sexy quality in and of itself.

    They were always told "One day, the right person will come along and it will be magical" and that only jackasses went out and actively tried to meet women. There was definitely a sentiment that the only "right way" to meet someone was to sit back and just wait for them to come along. Or that *everything* has to be perfect before you start dating someone…that was another classic…

    And don't even get me started if you're part of a lot of christian churches nowadays, lol…I've ended up hanging out with some of that crowd, and they actually actively tell people to act in a way that's the opposite of being attractive. This passive guy I knew was being told again and again that a good marriage was based on him always doing whatever his wife asked of him, practically no matter what – he was being told he needed to be even *more* passive than he was already being, that that was the way to a good marriage. It was kind of funny actually, because on the other side of me was a totally macho, narcissistic, self-involved and self-satisfied guy who probably could have used that advice – because for him in practice it would be meant more like "don't be *totally* selfish in your marriage".

    Anyways, I've realized that I've both felt a lot better and had better (at least) success in my dating when I started realizing that some of the things that I thought "made me an asshole" were – completely untrue. It's not just a lie – I totally had the backbone and whatever to ask her out, I just thought that if I did she would think I was an asshole – and I was *dead wrong*, some of these times I've since found out that she wanted me to ask her out and when I didn't she moved on.

    My point is – some "nice guys" do it because they've been told (often by women, or "moral" authorities) that only assholes do what women actually want you to do. I'm not sure I have a point beyond that – I'm not complaining (well I'm complaining a little, but I feel far worse for my church going friends who have to go through the process of the women also telling them that they want them to behave in the opposite way that they actually want them to behave in), mostly I'm just writing down my thoughts.

    • Toffeemama says:

      Your comment about churches reminds me of a book that my husband read just after we got married; it's called _No More Christian Nice Guy_ . That book is what first introduced us to the concept of the Nice Guy, and why churchgoers were especially misguided about masculinity.

    • Thank you Paul, I was sexually abused in the church and I have always thought this to be a reason for my shyness. I do express myself from time to time but I am no big talker and I realize this ia a shut-off to girls. I wish people were a little more willing to know one another rather that embrace all these myths about masculinity, power and performance.

    • Athirson says:

      There is a lot of bad information out there, and that is a big part of the problem. So much so, that I think a good way to capsulize the author's advice here is …Don't be an asshole to women; instead, adopt the traits of the asshole that women are attracted to. …Yet, I don't think he had the balls to frame it that way for fear of the PC police.

  10. Whenever I catch myself playing the "All women like X" or "No women like be because of Y", I stop the thought there, think a bit more about the source of the thought, then refute it. (This goes for any negative thought that follows the pattern of "All A are B" or "A never B's," or attempts to predict the future based on a black-and-white view of the past)

    This is a well known way that your brain fucks with you. They are called Automatic Negative Thoughts. They crop up from of the background noise of your consciousness, and because they originate from within your own mind you will believe them true by default. Part of my fight with depression and social anxiety has been learning to recognize these thoughts when they enter my conscious stream, then contending with them. Their source, rather than being rational, is actually irrational, and so it's a matter of bringing to mind examples that contradict the thought. It's not that hard to do, once or twice, but it is a challenge to pick up as a habit.

  11. Thepandabear says:

    This is perhaps the 5th article that I have read which stresses the importance of confidence. I guess confidence is everything .

    • Confidence is when you can talk proudly about your sci fi movie collection, confidence is laughing when you trip on that last step on a stair, confidence is saying ‘I love this song’ whenever a really old or a really sappy or a super poppy song comes on.
      Confidence is nothing more than how we externalize our self respect, we tend to confuse putting others below ourselves for prioritizing and loving ourselves. That’s why people who are resentful put others down so they can seem ‘cooler’ in comparison, that to me is the definition of a true asshole. Meanwhile people who are actually nice know their own strengths (and weaknesses) and there fore treat themselves and others accordingly.

      • raindancing says:

        Confidence also comes into the dating arena in the form of being able to ask someone out directly and respectfully, without any "I'm sure you won't want to" business, or worse, the ambiguous-date plan, where you're not clear as to whether it's supposed to be a friends-activity or a date-activity. Confidence also comes in when you get rejected— a confident person can accept a "no" gracefully, because it's not a judgement on your worth as a person.

  12. Stupendous-Man says:

    Was I the only one who thought this article was going to be completely different and a lot weirder based on the title?

  13. Good advice here. One topic that wasn't covered (I guess because the Doc thinks it's obvious) is if all those behaviors are good things to emulate, what else is left to being a jerk that you DON'T do?

    Other than being outwardly rude, disrespectful, insulting and manipulative, what else is left that a jerk does that a "good guy" shouldn't?

    And the other problem I have is in comparing confidence with arrogance and jerk-like behavior. Figuring out the difference between the two has always confused me.

    On the outside it might seem the same (such as how jerks 'come off' as having confidence) but a jerk gets there from having a rude/disrespectful mindset. It's easy for him, he doesn't care about who he offends or insults or hurts. How is a 'good' guy supposed to internally feel about what he's doing when he 'acts like a jerk' in order to act confident? Is he also supposed to not care about who he offends or insults or hurts? That doesn't seem like it makes sense.

    And even more important than what a good guy's mindset /is/, how do you /get/ to that state of mind if you're currently at the "I don't want to inconvenience them" stage? =P

    • It actually reminds me of something I learned while in a Bible study in college. I know merely saying that will bring out prejudices in a lot of people here, but there are some principles which are worthwhile regardless of religion.

      It talked about the differences between confidence, pride, humility, and low self esteem. (Pride, in Christianese lingo, always takes a negative connotation. i.e arrogance)

      Pride comes from comparing yourself to others, as a result lifting yourself up at others' expense.

      Low self esteem occurs when you compare yourself to others, and you never add up.

      You have Humility when you set realistic expectations for yourself, based on an internal standard. The internal standard may come from your personal values or your religion, whatever is applicable.

      Confidence grows when you compare yourself to an internal standard, where you achieve your goals.

      We talk about confidence a lot here, but I am curious how women really respond to genuine humility. We all know how women respond to low self esteem, but I bet a positive "I don't give a fuck what the world thinks of me" attitude highly attractive. In any case, you notice the key difference between the good traits and the bad traits: where you place your center.

      • That's really interesting and actually very true!

        • Being confident has nothing to do with doing jerky things or acting jerky. Being confident has everything to do with knowing that your thoughts and what you have to offer people in a social situation has value and you respect that value.

          A confident guy will engage in conversations and contribute to them with his own thoughts in an appropriate manner. A confident guy will show interest in something other than himself, but then tell you why he finds whatever it is interesting. A confident guy will be honest, and not be afraid of honesty in return. A confident guy will let his intentions be known. And a confident guy smiles.

          A jerk will dominate conversations and "shut down" those that try to steal his thunder or give an opposing position. A jerk will only show interest in himself and the things he likes. A jerk might be honest about finding you hot, but then will lie his pants off to get into yours. A jerk will demand you react favorably to his intentions, then insult you if you don't. And a jerk smirks.

          Bottom line, a confident guy will catch a woman's attention and make her feel beautiful and interesting. A jerk will demand a woman's attention and make her feel lusted after.

          Now if a girl has issues, lusted after might be enough to prop up a low self-esteem. Maybe she sees a bully as powerful and wants to be "with" that, instead of the victim of it. (Which is completely dumb) Ignore those girls.

          Because a confident "Good Girl" will make you feel interesting and attractive as well.

      • GentlemanJohnny says:

        I love the phrasing here, JD. The prideful (ie arrogant) person and the one with low self esteem both need exterior validation. If a prideful man hits on a woman and gets shot down, something must be wrong with her not him. If a guy with low self esteem gets shot down its because something's wrong with him. Either way, they approached someone in the first place because they were interested in her as a source of validation, not a person.

        The humble or confident man is self contained. Either one is much more likely to talk to a woman and take the conversation for what it is moment to moment. There's nothing to prove and no one's in the wrong if its brief and never goes any farther because these guys don't have to prove they're good people, they already know they are. Because of that, they can approach other people as people rather than as external validation sources.

        This extends way beyond dating and meeting people. A confident guy in a relationship doesn't feel the need to be controlling. He's already got a committed relationship. On the job he doesn't need to belittle his coworkers because their success in no way invalidates his own, even if they're outshining him.

        TL;DR – Respecting yourself makes it easier to treat others with respect.

    • Stardrake says:

      Think about how much of a confidence-booster it would be for you to be approached by a woman, even if you reject her (due to being already attached, not particularly attracted to her, or whatever). As long as you don't make her uncomfortable by being creepy or skeevy, and it's not a case of her having been approached a dozen times in the last hour or just plain busy, demonstrating that she's attractive enough to be worth approaching is more of a sincere compliment than an inconvenience. Even if she's later complaining to her friends about how you dared to approach her, there's likely an undercurrent of boasting and feeling good to be asked.

      When it comes to the difference – the key is to respect the woman and to respect yourself. Jerks on the whole don't respect the people around them – you get the odd person who acts jerkishly about the small things but will come through for the important stuff, but when you get to know them they're distinguishable from actual jerks.

    • I think the difference between a confident guy taking on the world and a jerk only being out for himself is the underlying intent. Take one scenario two different ways:

      1. Confident guy hits on a girl and asks her for her phone number. Girl turns him down. He smiles, shrugs, thanks her for her time and moves on to the next opportunity.

      2. Jerky guy hits on a girl and asks for her phone number. Girl turns him down. He scoffs and lumbers off, muttering something about said girl being a bitch and/or lesbian.

      The same actions happened, but the mindset of each hypothetical guy is different. One guy is optimistic in the face of failure, the other guy is a negative ass. Refusing to let things get you down or tear other people down for your problems is a really respectable, attractive quality and it's one that confident guys have in spades. You don't have to be a jerk to not sweat the small stuff.

      And as for "inconveniencing women," it's not like you're asking a girl for a ride to the airport or for your mother to stay over for a week. You're just asking her for the chance to get to know her better. If for whatever reason, she can't or doesn't want to take you up on your offer, you only cost her, what, a couple minutes of her life? Not a big deal. And if she does treat it like a big deal, she's probably high maintenance and you don't want her anyway.

      I hope this helps you on your way. Confidence is sexy, but so is optimism!

      • I like everything that you said, but I think the jerk in your scenario isn't the best example of a jerk who might get women. Scoffing and mumbling aren't qualities that will help someone in life, no matter what the rest of their attitude is. A true asshole, when rejected, laughs it off and doesn't give a shit. He might make the excuse that she's a bitch or a lesbian, but he's not going to mope about it, and scoffing and mumbling invoke images of moping in my mind. The assholes who laugh it off are the ones who are successful in the dating world. But everything else you said is still true, I just wanted to point out the difference in asshole-ish-ness.

      • I like this comment so much, because it reminds me Sir Ken Robinson's talks on education, and how we instil the fear of failure in kids.

        If we follow that thought, we're basically breeding (even more) assholes.

  14. latebloomer says:

    My theories on why some guys think all women like assholes are as follows:

    They are jealous of the fact that said man has the woman he wants.

    They are assholes that just can't sell it as well as the more attractive assholes.

    They don't pay attention to what the women around them want. If an asshole is scratching their itch who are they to judge? Assholes rarely have fullfilling long lasting relationships with any woman good or bad.

    I could also pull out the idea that i have no proof of that maybe said guys want a woman with low self esteme rayher than the ones around them that will not take abuse. I dont think it is so much about the men as it is about the type of women the respective men are going after.

    • You come off as a bit cynical.

    • Every time I hear a guy say "All women want assholes," he might as well say "I am extremely bitter about my shortcomings and am unwilling to address whatever problems I've got drive that women away." Guys like this are mad at the world (not to mention borderline misogynistic) and they wonder why women prefer other men.

      Buy a clue, bitter guys. She didn't pick the college bro over you because she can't recognize what a nice guy you are. She passed you over because you reek of anger, negativity and desperation and she wants no part of that. No self-respecting woman would.

      If you want the girl of your dreams (or just some cute girl across the classroom), you need to check your attitude at the door. Instead of telling yourself "all women want assholes," maybe change the dialogue with yourself and say "All girls want a confident, assertive, positive guy and I can be that for them." You will be amazed at the power of positive suggestion. Even if you don't believe it now, if you behave like you do and continue to validate yourself, you will begin to feel it.

      • Jasmine, dead on. I agree 100%

        This is the same flawed mentality as women who complain "guys just want skinny bitches over nice girls."

        Even if a woman has a few extra lbs. but carries herself in a feminine way and has a fun, playful attitude, she can be VERY sexy.

        Of course, if she has a negative outlook about what the opposite sex wants, she will end up as dateless or unfulfilled as guys who do the same.

        • … Or that guys only like girls that put out or girls that wear makeup or girls who dress a certain way. It's a surprisingly prevalent attitude in both sexes.

          • "Or that guys only like girls that put out"

            yeah they do. so do women in regards to guys.

            have you READ this blog? or studied people in general?

        • a guy can get away with being not so great looking (unless you're incredibly ugly) because women judge more on personality and feel attraction to it. Guys always judge on looks first before personality.

          so if you're a not so attractive girl you're usually screwed. why else do you never see blogs giving dating advice for women? because women have to rely attracting males with their looks…

          • You've honestly never seen a blog giving dating advice to women? Really? Because I'm fairly sure there's a few hudred or so rattling around out there. Never mind all the countless magazines devoted almost entirely to the subject. And thecolumnists in newspapers. And the radio talk shows… Etc, etc, etc. There's a hell of a lot moredating advicefor women than formen, out there and it's a lot more obvious too

          • Well of course a lot of the dating advice out there is of dubious quality at best. But there are good dating adice sites for women out there

          • So I decided to test my google-fu on this one and have found, after cursory examination, that eHarmony has a decent dating tips section that is free and interesting. I'm assuming that it's not the only serious dating website that has this. I seem to remember the geek-oriented dating site I had a profile on a few years back had a decent advice blog. I found a few others sites, in the first two or three pages of the search, that gave decent, helpful advice of the kind you find here. This does include the dating sections in such sites as "Canadian Living", but it just goes to show that good advice blogs for women do exist. Bad dating advice for men exists as well, by the way. I saw quite a few advice articles for guys that made my hair curl…

          • latebloomer says:

            I have read a few things that the Doc linked… and you aren't lying. They're God AWFUL. Mainly, I think, because they encourage guys to treat women like crap, but heh.

          • Athirson says:

            They judge based on status, power and $ more than anything. Not that I blame them. I don't figure they have any more control over what they are attracted to than we do, and it certainly makes sense from an evolutionary perspective.

    • Athirson says:

      I do think there is some good empirical evidence to support the theory. Eg. the appalling rates of divorce, domestic violence and cheating are not the product of a long string of tragic coincidences. Like everything else, these things are that way they are for a reason, and the thesis that women, generally speaking, are more attracted to assholes than nice guys certainly fits.

  15. Brilliant article.

    One addition I would make is this:

    The myth of women liking assholes is further perpetuated by the fact that some guys turn INTO assholes when dating a woman for looks only.

    Here's an example:

    A guy who was a band geek, science geek, and Star Trek fan can date a girl who is stripper hot, discover he has nothing in common with her, and end up treating her very badly (even in public).

    Then, a nice guy sees said behavior and concludes that women like assholes.

    The truth is, maybe that same "Bad Boy" will treat a different girl better because she is not only attractive but smart and in possession of healthy self-esteem.

    In fact, most women who are attractive, smart, and confident, laugh at douchebag, asshole type guys. These types of women would happily date a geeky or even nerdy guy if the guy takes some initiative to act like a strong, confident man.

    Seriously. Take it from a former band geek, science geek, and Star Trek fan. Just remember to leave the "I Grok Spock" t-shirt home until after the 3rd date…

    • 'Stripper hot' ? really? Care to rephrase that?

      • I think what Jimmy's saying here is this theoretical girl might have an oversexualized style about her that most of society associates with strippers. I don't judge anyone for wanting a woman who carries herself that way. Strippers or stripper-like women need love too.

        Jimmy's scenario sounds like it might've been based on personal experience. If it is, I hope he learned from his actions. Just because you might not be on the same intellectual level as your date, it's not okay to treat her badly or insult her. If things aren't working, get out cleanly and quickly and most of all with civility.

        • Yes, I got that but it's still somewhat, let us say crass, to call a woman 'stripper hot'. It's right up there with calling your woman a 'ho' and 'bitch' and while I'm sure it's a waste of time to point this out to Jimmy let us state here and now for future reference; if you find a woman attractive calling her 'stripper hot' isn't going to make her feel all warm and gooey inside.

          • Oh, I'm sure calling a woman stripper-hot is a guaranteed way to get a drink thrown in your face in many circumstances. I figured that much was obvious, but maybe not so to some people. After all, this is a blog aimed at shy nerds with social hang-ups.

          • Devicat,

            I never said I called anyone "stripper hot" to their face. Where did you read that?

            If you are worried about words offending female readers, you need not worry. Relax. I'm sure Maggie and Jasmine are smart girls and their heads didn't explode after reading my post.

            My point was to add a different component to the reason why this "Assholes Finish First" myth perpetuates. It's all about causality vs. correlation.

            If a shy, socially-awkward, overly-apologetic man (i.e., "nerd") sees an attractive woman being mistreated, he might conclude that ALL very attractive women like jerks or "bad boys."

            He sees causality. He sees "Being an asshole causes hot women to like you."

            If a cocky jerk who has dated certain women just for their looks and regretted it because those women were too much work or aggravation, he does not draw the same conclusion.

            He sees correlation. He sees "Acting like an asshole is correlated to dating a woman just for her looks."

            Yes, all my ideas are based on experiential evidence.

            I handed in my geek card when I was 21. Handed in my asshole card when I was 30. Now in my mid-30s, I have my "Nobody Really Knows Anything" card.

            I'll probably never hand that one in :)

            http://malemetrics.com/how-to-be-a-geek-that-wome

          • Except you used it in your dialogue to describe women in general. So its okay to think it, just not say it out loud? Or its okay to put it on a forum where women are? Just…don't use that term again where other women can read it and/or hear it because it's going to get a really negative reaction.

  16. My friend has been telling us this for years. He refers to it as the "bit of a bastard" rule.

    • It still doesn't excuse the behavior and attitude towards woman; its offensive and it skates along the edge of misogyny.

      • Paul Rivers says:

        lol, so what, when (and I said when, it doesn't *always* happen) guy are a bit of a bastard, and women respond to it – let me guess – you blame the guy, right?

        • I'm having a little trouble understanding what you wrote. Are you saying if a guy is a 'bit' of a bastard, as in he's overall offense as hell and is doing is his best to get a rise out of his intended victim-oops, I mean, interest and she rises to the occasion and tells him to fuck off and unjustly blames him for being as ass in the first place? and blaming him is completely unjust because, hey, he's only being a 'bit' of a bastard? Sooo, we don't take responsibility for our own actions but blame the little voices in our head that said it was a GOOD idea to piss off the potential romantic interest in a sad attempt to have a 'conversation'? Then, yes I would blame him for being a man-child that hasn't addressed his own emotional immaturity.

          Unless I completely misunderstood what you were saying by someone being a 'bit' of a bastard.

          • Paul Rivers says:

            First, I wasn't really thinking about "a bit of a bastard" turning into "overall offense as hell and is doing is his best to get a rise out of his intended victim". That's not what I thought by "a bit"…the definition I have in mind was "A small portion, degree, or amount".

            Second, I don't know how anyone can reasonably think that getting upset at someone who butted in to bother you by being a jerk is your fault. They can *claim* that it is – it doesn't mean it has any validity to it.

            I'm…not sure how you got from your first response to your second response. Maybe there was some sort of misunderstanding. What you were saying sounded like "When a jerk is a bit of a jerk and the women loves it, it's his fault". What you said in your second comment was *totally* different. So…I'm not sure where I would go with that. We are apparently talking about totally and completely different things.

            Imagine you're talking to a girl and another guy comes up and buts into your conversation. What's being a bit of a bastard? Either cutting him off, or moving on to flirt with the girl next to her. A friend of mine tried to make out with a girl he had been hanging out with. She said "No, I'm not that kind of girl". In the past he would have totally, totally backed off. But fortunately for him, he realized that actually believing her was being "to nice". Don't get me wrong – he backed off momentarily. Later that night he tried it again. To him, he was being a bit of a bastard by not believing her strongly worded claim that she "wasn't that kind of girl". But by the second time she had self justified how every time they had hung out had been a "date" so it was now it was "ok"…in high school I remember there were always quite a number of girls who were never single. They would break up with their boyfriend, then immediately start dating someone else. Now…how do you suppose that happened? I guarantee you the new guy had been interested in the girl while she had her previous boyfriend. Watch any romantic comedy – even the socially acceptable mainstream guy who gets the girl is "a bit of a bastard". Was Han Solo in Star Wars a bit of a bastard? The bastard shot first. :D He kept after Leia even after she turned him down again and again. I just saw "War Games", and while not any sort of amazing movie, the whole movie is the two guys being a bit of a bastard. You can look at Pride and Prejudice – she spends half the book thinking of the guy she ends up with as pretty much being a bastard. Near the end he explains…most of what he did. But…not everything. Now he's just a bit of a bastard, and frankly it doesn't change that he obsession with him develops when she thinks of him as kind of a bastard. And those are the socially acceptable models.

  17. "Act Like An Nice Guy, Think Like An Asshole" is this Steve Harvey approved.

  18. "Think about fishing: do you tell the story about the one that you eased out of the water like a young man stepping out of the bath or the one you had to fight tooth and nail to land?"

    Doctor, I've seen you make analogies like this before, and I'm very skeptical. People go fishing primarily for the challenge of catching something, and only to a lesser extent to get the actual fish itself (e.g. to eat it). On the other hand, I want a relationship primarily because I would be happy being in one, not because I'd enjoy the challenge of getting a relationship. A better analogy, at least for me, would be: would you rather work hard all your life to get rich, or have someone randomly come along and hand you a check for lots of money? I think many people would choose the latter.

  19. Well you obviously haven't read the blog yourself… Because while there is some advice on how to just getlaid, most of it is geared towards how to get arelationship. And sex is a part of that, yes, but it isn't the only thing involved. Read the article that Dr. Nerdlove published a little while ago on what consent is and what it isn't. Maybe you'll come a little closer to understanding.

    Also, it's a fallacy to believe that ALL guys/girls want the same specific thing. If that was true, seulement a small, very homogeneous subset of the population would ever find a date and therefore seulement a small fraction of humanity would ever reproduce. We would all look alike, there'd be much less of us and we'd probably be riddled with diseses that were the productod inbreeding, if that were the case

    • Athirson says:

      Fair enough, but here is something to chew on. In the course of mapping the human genome, one of the more interesting discoveries was that approximately 80% of the human females who have ever lived on Earth have reproduced, while seulement 40% of the men have. While it is indeed a mistake to use words like tout le monde to describe human behavior, we can and should make deductions based on the evidence.

      • THIS IS A MYTH. It was a thought experiment. Yes, it was discussed in a research paper, but there is ZERO DATA backing this. Please do not spread this lie any further. There is NO EVIDENCE for this except some dude making it up.

  20. latebloomer says:

    Maggie,

    From what I understand most dating advice for women centers around how they should do make up/dress/lose weight and have sex. I haven't read everything out there, but from what I've found and seen… no dating advice blog for women covers the kind of stuff Dr. Nerdlove writes.

    • Athirson says:

      Because dating for women isn't as complicated. Look your best and make good decisions covers about 90% of it.

  21. Italiaboi24 says:

    I think there's a lesson to learn here: those really hot girls that we ALL want who are with asshole dudes… Are nothing but disease harboring inconsiderate women in the first place. This is a girl who is toxic to be around, a girl that is inconsiderate, and the perfect example of the girl you DON'T want to have a relationship with. (a meaningful one at least)

    Just think about that for a few seconds then read on below:

    1. Be assertive
    2. Don't be needy
    3. Read body language
    4. Have a fucking opinion for god's sake.

  22. travis51 says:

    Its not that they like them because they are assholes, its that they are ass holes because then can be jerks- these guys are mostly physically attractive and as a result can get away with alot of behavior that if a more average/ugly guy did would have him laughed, seen as a creep, or end up with a face-full of mace

    Women are very picky when it comes to appearance sure there may be a few exceptions but the more attractive they are the more exponentially picky they are- 'assholes' know this and know fully exploit it, all this talk about confidence, humor and and being your better self is feel-good crap;

    if you want to be a ladies man YOU MUST BE EXTREMELY GOOD looking, that means a six-pack, full head of hair, symmetrical features- have a modicum of social skills and you are set

    • Paul Rivers says:

      Keith Richards:
      http://www.nerve.com/files/dispatches/nerveeditor

      Steven Tyler:
      http://bostonist.com/attachments/austinist_kerry/

      Mick Jagger:
      http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv

      Have you seen Steve Tyler? I mean the guy gets how to dress, how to walk, dress, look – but dang, take a look at his face. That is one *ugly* dude. One thing he does is dress in interesting looking stuff so you aren't just staring at his face.

      You'd probably say that he's a celibrity, so that's kind of different (and likely not attainable for most people). And there is some question about whether modern guys can pull off the same thing – nowadays guys on tv and in movies all have hair and look good.

      But I just watched my friends dad's friend (point being – a guy in his 50's or 60's) who is not good looking (he's not ugly either, but he's kind of overweight, has hair but nothing special – no one is looking at his picture in magazines) pick up on our friend – an attractive girl in her mid 20's who does some modelling. The older guy is dating a 28 year old girl – heck, I slightly wondered if it was really true until he obviously started hitting it off with the girl who was with us.

      Looks just aren't at the top of the priority list for girls like they are for guys. There is a point where you just can't be as much of an in-your-face jerk if you aren't as good looking.

      I do wonder about hair, or being really, really, really ugly…but if you're just "not good looking" guys pull that off all the time.

      • Dr. NerdLove says:

        I feel that I should point out that Steve Tyler is Steve goddamn Tyler: rock god. That helps. A lot.

  23. Paul Rivers says:

    lol, yeah, but I'm just sayin' – no amount of rock star status would make Oprah into a sex symbol for guys like it did for Steven Tyler. :D

    I always thought that girl from No Doubt was cute but the fact that she was in a band and I listened to some of her music didn't make me think "oh, she's *so* sexy!!" like it did for Steven Tyler.

    Or Scarlett Johansson – if she had done the exact same things and played the exact same roles she did, but looked like the female equivalent of Steven Tyler – no way she would be considered by guys to be a sex symbol like she is today.

    Steven Tyler is awesome, but the other poster claimed the *only way* to be a ladies man is to be extremely good looking with a list of physical requirements, and he's at least one exception to this rule. After watching a guy in his 50's or 60's (who btw, was not in terribly good shape or anything) pick up on the mid-20's girl we were with, I'm just sayin' that clearly there's other ways to be a ladies man, without being born with good looks.

    • Athirson says:

      He was wrong of course, but not just for the reason(s) you mentioned. Women are much more attracted to power, status, and $ than any other factor you can name. This goes well beyond rock stars and even Yankee infielders. Even if you aren't one of those, you can still date out of your league if you get yourself a decent career and start pulling in some $. Just don't forget protection if you hook up, and don't get married w/o a prenup.

  24. One of the problems with the "nice guy" vs. asshole discussion is that it presupposes that their intentions are the same. That they both just want meaningless sex from the girl that caught their eye. (and of course the girl is physically flawless, because a guy being interested in a girl besides her looks is just crazy talk, right?) They presuppose that all the nice guy's emotional availability, listening, support and hanging out together is all just a big lie to get laid, and that the assholes just skip all that and say, "Wanna fuck?" and the women are so refreshed by this honesty that they drop their panties right then and there. It's never even considered that the nice guy actually means all these things and wants to date the girl. The trick seems to be if you DO want all the friendzone things without being in the friendzone then you have to hide your true feelings, lie and act in ways you don't want to in order to get the girl.

    • This, this, this… a million times this. I want to say it has been a long, long time since I've felt as insulted and disgusted as I did reading the No More Mr. Nice Guy post. The presumption that a guy agrees to be friendly to a woman just to get into her pants is so blatantly prejudiced and sexist as to be detrimental to overall gender relations (something in dire need of fixing in the gamer/ geek communities as is). Dr. Nerdlove states that women are attracted not to assholes, but to men who have the sort of confidence that they assert what they want, and act as though they are going to take the woman home with them, no question. The problem with that is that it objectifies women more than all the skin magazines in the world could ever hope to. Nice guys see women not as a prize, or an objective, or a plaything… but as a person. You know, with thoughts and feelings and stuff. What do we keep hearing from women in our culture through TV and print? That they hate men who are only into them for sex, and they hate players. So yes, nice guys will err on the side of not being too assertive; they want people they like to not be uncomfortable, so they might hold back on saying, "Hey, I want to turn you upside down and take you to happy town." Not out of a lack of confidence or anything, but just out of respect for a fellow human being. I think most women underestimate just how difficult it is to differentiate between "hard to get" and "not interested". Yes, I understand that women can be more sexually drawn to men who'll sweep them off their feet, take them home, ride them rough and put them away wet. It's hot. But I'm sorry, we're living in a post-feminism world, and all of our gender roles and expectations have been turned upside down and inside out. As a result, then your really hot, pull-your-hair-while-doing-you guys are going to be assholes who see you as an object, and the nice guys who treat you as a person will take a bit of training and patience to get what you want in bed out of them. It will take some work and effort on women's behalf, which due to a warped combination of lingering gender roles and modern sexual expectations, I don't think many modern American women realize. The "handsome prince" fantasy doesn't reconcile itself very well with modern equality views, but in my opinion it's a worthwhile tradeoff for being able to vote and not being treated as a child incapable of making one's own decisions. (Disclaimer: yes, there are some men who can walk that very, very fine line between being sexily dominating, and still respectful of you as a person. There are also the occasional women who wear high-heels while cooking, will blow you while you're playing video games, just for the fun of it. Dated a girl like that, actually. However, it's incredibly foolish to expect such behavior from all, or even most, women. Same with expecting that level of perfection in men.)

      • I think that you're applying the advice from No More Nice Guy and this article in the wrong way. It's not that you need to be a dick to be 'successful' with women, it's that you need to be confident and honest. Those are traits that an asshole has that are admirable traits in admirable people. The asshole's honesty, confidence, and self validation are good tools put to bad use. But that doesn't make them bad tools, and in fact they are great tools. But they aren't actually tools, because we're not machines that get repaired or fixed or tinkered with. They are just awesome personality traits that will make every aspect of your life better.

        And there is a disconnect between what you're reading and what is written in these articles about Nice Guys (with capitals). The Nice Guys who are friendly, caring, compassionate, nice, what-have-you, act that way with the goal of a relationship. They do not make their feelings clear, but they do expect to get a 'return' on their 'investment.' That is the problem with Nice Guys. They aren't being nice with the sole purpose of getting into a girl's pants, but they are doing it because they are hoping she will fall in love with him and a wonderful butterflies and songbirds relationship will follow (which will of course still includes him getting laid). That isn't to say YOU are this Nice Guy. I'm not trying to say that at all, but those other Nice Guys do exist. They might not be bad in the same way as assholes are, but they are still a poisonous personality. It creates an expectation that shouldn't be there. They are nice because they expect to get a relationship out of it. Nice Guys might be genuinely nice people, and they might be nice to everyone and not just women who they want to be with. But when it comes to that specific interaction, with the women they want to be with, the niceness of other aspects of their life is not applied in a positive way.

    • Nope asshole is another word for hot- it’s not the horrible attitude, but the fact the guy is most likely a hot sexy piece and women find him attractive and want to sleep with him. simple. if you want to compete then hit the gym and plastic surgeon and stop bitching. It is obvious you betas are complaint that you can’t get women that are out of your league (ie. women only like assholes- which translates to, that hot girl I want is dating a hot guy- boohoo). So again, either join a gym and call a plastic surgeon for a consult, or DATE the women in YOUR OWN LEAGUE.

  25. so… women are atracted to assholes?
    after all, saying: "what really attracts women are attributes and behaviors that often correspond with being an asshole"
    is like saying a woman likes how an asshole acts, and since your acts define who you are, you're just saying in a very apologetic way that women like assholes
    I'm not trying to troll here, but seriusly, just take a look at some extreme examples:
    in the trial of Ted Bundy (serial killer, rapist, necrophile; killed about 30 women) several women where trying to give him love letters and even marriage proposals!
    I've been atracted to girls for many different reasons, but none of them was "because she's a psychopath"
    how do you explain that?
    or at least I hope you do since this post is a few months old

    • Well, there are plenty of mentally ill, abused women out there that just don't think very well… just like there are men who are mentally ill, abused, and just don't think very well. A mentally healthy woman is going to be disgusted by Ted Bundy and want him to be executed, not want to have his babies. You can't take a few mentally ill people and decide that they're the norm, because they're not.

      Also, assholes don't normally start off as assholes. They also go through women a lot faster than you might realize. Their confidence is attractive, but as soon as the woman realizes she's dealing with an asshole, she moves on. Assholes tend to be confident, but not all assholes are. Those assholes are unlikely to find a woman who will stick around. If they do, it is someone who lacks a great deal of self esteem and confidence of her own. She is easy for him to degrade and control. A woman who is with an asshole honestly believes that she can't do any better and that only he will ever love her, and she believes that she loves him. Physical attraction isn't enough to keep someone in an abusive relationship.

      Also, behaviors that many assholes (the ones that people woe women being attracted to) do not have a corner on the confidence market. I know plenty of nice guys that are incredibly attractive to women. In fact, my dad is one of them. He is completely faithful to my mom, loves her, and would do anything for her… and women are always trying to turn his head (and they fail so badly that it is ridiculous). He's over 50 years old and he just has a charm and charisma that attract women to him. He isn't an asshole… not most of the time anyway (every person has their moments).

      And for all those guys that have the girl crying about how mean and abusive her boyfriend is and you don't understand why she can't forget him and go out with you… well, that shows a great deal of ignorance when it comes to victims in an abusive relationship. I know that it is frustrating, but you have to admit that if you're trying to lure her away you're kind of being an asshole.. because you aren't genuinely being her friend since you have ulterior motives for being around her in the first place.

      • Firts off, I could not get a precise number, but apparently Ted Bundy was receiving more than 200 love letters every day he spent in jail until he was executed, that's way too many letters to simply shrug off as just the work of mentally ill women.

        Second, thinking a girl only dates an asshole simply because she does not know that he's an asshole and will dump him as soon as she realizes that strikes me as rather naive of your part, after all, I have seen many cases of women dating arrogant and badly mannered men because they think they are special and that they can change him, which is, in my opinion, such an absurd mentality that should not be excusable in any way (much to the doc's dismay, who seems to go out of his way to justify certan ludicrous attitudes such as this and even victimizing women who do that).

        Finaly, I don't know if that last paragraph was directed to me, but if it was, let me respond to that: I've never befriended anyone with ulterior motives like the "nice guys" do. Hell, that sentence could pretty much be shortened to "I've never befriended anyone, period", I'm not very well related to people and in fact, I like that. So if you wanna think of me as a self-centered anti-social egotistical prick you would be pretty much right, but don't try to paint me as another one of the infamous manipulative passive-agressive douches that the internet has come to know as "nice guys"

        PS: please excuse my english.

        • Athirson says:

          RE: Firts off, I could not get a precise number, but apparently Ted Bundy was receiving more than 200 love letters every day he spent in jail until he was executed, that's way too many letters to simply shrug off as just the work of mentally ill women.

          As was the Night Stalker, Richard Ramirez, or Scott Peterson, or just about any other notorious criminal you care to name. Or consider Charles Manson, who had his own harem.

          Many, many women have ended up dead or dismembered because of their inability to resist the charms of psychopaths.

    • Dr_NerdLove says:

      Women and serial killers is a different animal than women and assholes. And since it delves pretty deeply into psychology (Doctor NerdLove is NOT a real doctor, remember) it's also rather outside the remit of this blog.

      There've been dozens of books written about this phenomena that attribute it to everything from evolutionary psychology to intense fanaticism (James Holmes has a fan club, y'know) to a desire for fame or the search for the "perfect" boyfriend.

      • Care to address his point, DNL? Upon reading the article, I have to agree that what you are saying is "what really attracts women are attributes and behaviors that often correspond with being an asshole" , which really is just a nice way of saying that women like assholes.

  26. 100% of Women LOVE ASSHOLES.

    That's at least what this online poll shows: https://www.inqu.me/vote#!qid=women_like_assholes Honestly, I think the reason for this vote result is that only ASSHOLES voted so I share this now with others so they can vote as well and change this result! Wanna help me?

  27. How exactly was the Alpha Male/bad boy theory disproven in this article? The author immediately tells what PUAs have always been saying – if you're not an Alpha then emulate one. Humans are sexually dimorphic thus women are attracted to the manliest men. It's long known that those with strong vertical bilateral symmetry are larger, healthier, stronger and have sex earlier as well have more sex partners. In other words, human sexuality is mostly innate. The notion that geeks can make more money to outbid the Alpha Males is laughable as taller, handsome men generally make more money.

    • Kam Swayne says:

      Maturity, I see couples that are totally different but are in love. And there very mature. They don’t play stupid games like your a douchebag because your a nice guy.. Grow up people!!!

  28. Kam Swayne says:

    I think assholes don’t like “nice guys” because they are very insecure about themselves and they hate seeing nice guys with hot women.
    So they need to treat women like shit to pump themselves up. Because they feel inferior with nice guys.
    I’m a nice guy and my wife is Korean and she is hot.
    Sorry, assholes I have a beautiful wife who I treat well.
    But.. You can’t be nice all the time because she’ll get bored and walk!

  29. Kam Swayne says:

    Your on drugs, bro! You are totally off and ignorant… Wow.. I have witnessed a mishap in a human being. I don’t know what part of the world your from but it must be a place I do not want to live. To many closed minded peeps. Maybe, you live in Orange County, ca. Unf

  30. You claim its a myth but try having a woman look back at all of her past relationships, count the nice guys, count the ass holes, and compare the 2 results. You will see that almost all women date assholes and the results should speak for themselves.

  31. Alright here I will nail this coffin shut real quick. I got so much tail between the age 13 to 20 and I was the nice guy, a really horny nice guy.

    I made girls laugh, listened to them and the rest was history.

    And no it did not stop at 20. Getting women has never been a problem for me and I have always been the nice guy. I am just saying that being nice mixed with confidence does work and anyone who tells you different is just pissed off they are not getting any action.

  32. someone tell this douche bag to stop calling women hot chicks for he sounds like himself a selfish asshole who only wants sex. i'm a happily married man and respect my wife so all you single alpha males who think women like you due your assholes your right they do for their trash themselves with no self esteem. american and eastern european women are the worst tramps on earth.

    • Gentleman Horndog says:

      Most of the hot chicks I've dated didn't seem terribly interested in my asshole, nor were they … trash-rights activists? Advocates of taking out the trash as a path to better self-esteem? I'm afraid I'm having a lot of trouble understanding what it is you're trying to say.

      Now, coherent use of the English language? I've found chicks DEFINITELY dig that.

  33. The "be honest" part assume that upon sight you know if you want / like someone. I don't know how it works for others, but I prefer to getting to know someone before making my mind up if I'm interested in them or not, which can totally change by such. According to this article (section) that's "not allowed". So men HAVE to be shallow ?

  34. Whats so hard about finding one great partner that fits and sticking to her.
    For the rest.
    Of.
    Your life.
    Society runs only on monogamy.

  35. By the way, most of this bullshit only counts in the USA or any other western culture extreme countries.
    In other countries it's .. more normal and you don't have to put up such fake douchebag acts.

  36. Robert Mudge says:

    You can write book after book on “female sexual psychology” but after thorough research and loads of personal experience it really comes down to three things to attract women sexually: looks, looks and money/power. Please note that looks counts as 2 out of the 3 and also note that I am writing about sex, not long lasting relationships. A woman will forgive a man for ANYTHING if he is physically attractive. “Oh you cheated on me with my sister and gave me and her an STD!, no biggie I am sure you are a nice guy deep down”. They will find an excuse to continue dating the most atrocious, nauseating diaper stains in the name of physical attraction. This is the way almost every woman is selfish and shallow. Try being an average looking joe with an honest job, see how many one night stands you can pull. This is just the cold hard truth. I am not asking women to change, they won’t, but at least accept it.

  37. Assholes have low self esteem, they spend most of their time insulting others to big themselves up this is low self esteem!

  38. "'Hey, we’re all really fucking complex machines' doesn’t sell a lot of books." It does if you're Ray Kurzweil.

    Of course, saying that we’re all really fucking complex machines implies that we're all really fucking.

Trackbacks

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  4. […] the wags – mighty armchair warriors, they – who will insist that these are the complaints of a “beta” who is whining about the macho assholes who stole his girlfriend. More power to them if they choose to believe […]

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